Bout time! Although Add-skipping and effects on Ice-TV and MS Native support are the real news items I'd like a response to, how many other products out there have 30 sec skip function and how will Tivo functionality affect this?

But still good to hear they will be creating and supporting the EPG themselves! Saves IceTV and others from inveting descriptions (although they were very entertaining at times!) or getting incorrect information for time slots etc...I wonder if start and finish times of shows will be affected, or will we still have to record 40 minutes of buffer after show end??

warren13

lolz....interestimng to read that statement about copyright protectuion....I wonder if an EPG supplied by them will be engineered to muddle with recordings for certain shows....eg. sports broadcasts etc

astro

It's the Telstra Heartbeat all over again!!

Thanks for getting straight on to it Adam.

Justin

Exactly. The technology is already in place to provide a free EPG to everyone, but the networks are insisting on extra protection to protect something they're giving away. It'll take at least a firmware upgrade to make CE gear compatible (assuming they don't need a hardware encryption chip) - and we've seen how LG is struggling to do all the firmware upgrades for its TVs. The encryption will be hacked anyway by people wanting it to work with non-compatible devices (a la DVD Jon) so all this does is punish innocent consumers. Again.

While MS and 9 do have a JV, I wouldn't say MS will just follow their lead. From what I understand MS desperately wants an EPG solution in Australia. It knows how much it adds to the MCE experience. After all, they went above and beyond to ensure the scanning was fixed to allow the existing 'unsupported' EPG solutions to work.

I wonder if they will offer the option of a MS-supplied EPG with a hotfix that disables the 30 second skip?

Mike

What no-one seems to have mentioned is that even with an EPG, the data in it will still be inherently incorrect. Very few programs will actually start when they are advertised to start in the EPG, so a lot of people are going to be very disappointed when their recordings get chopped at the start and end.

I'd like to see FreeTV Australia turn around and start enforcing program start times (like they do in the UK) .. without it, the guide is of significantly reduced benefit!

Maybe it's time for a class action against the TV networks for false advertising. I'd LOVE to see that!

AHA! - where's arkay - time for another of your petitions mate - look what a fantastic result your last one has just achieved!!

Well, that's kinda why we have pre and post padding...

Boring Boring...

You guys are getting to excited over nothing !!!!


Read between the lines guys - its nothing more than propoganda.....

1. The government took submissions last year on all things to do with digital TV. One of the items was concerning an EPG being available. The government has since said that they would consider making it law, that the FTA networks are to provide an EPG listing free of charge for use....

2. Engin and Seven get into bed together and announce the soon arrival of Tivo to Australia. Mind you its not Tivo, its only Engin licenced to use the brand / name / marketing / provide service / supply hardware of Tivo in this region. Oh and isn't there some common shareholders between Engin and Seven anyway..... hmmm....

3. Now, yesterday - FreeTV - a supposedly unbiased lobby group (of sorts) of the FTA channels come out and say that we are going to provide an EPG guide - Conditionally...

The conditions appear to prohibit IceTV in using it, they appear to prohibit Microsoft Australia in using it, and Myth and topfield and .....


- This EPG service, and assuming its free, because when it says a Free TV EPG - are they referrring to it being no cost, or its for Free to TV transmission ?

- This EPG service is for the Engin Tivo providor, and wont see the light of day anywhere else, as the downloadable Tivo guide is sent 'encrypted' (its known as a slice, and tools exist to unencrypt it by the way), the Tivo protects the content recordings (although again hacks exist to fix this), and the Tivo can limit ad skipping, and of course the Tivo reports back every keypress to base, to determine what you recorded, what you watched, what you skipped, what you watched again, where you paused - etc.

So you can see this 'announcement' is nothing more than agreement for a Tivo service - as no other hardware provider will bother entering the market, needing to change their firmware in topfields and the like, and also institute a reporting mechanism that is so detailed.

The announcement is nothing more than a promotional item for tivo in disguise !

Oh why do this ? Hmmm.... government says you shall provide an EPG or else we will make it law.... Now the come back will be, no need to make a law, as we freetv australia are a good body of individuals, and we can self govern the industry without the need of government intervention.

Next step, Government backs down... it says well this crowd FreeTV Australia are a good bunch of guys, they are providing a free service, we dont need to legislate it, and of course its only fair that some restrictions are around a free service to make it commercially attracted to the owners.

Lastly - with all this action, one of two things happen in the undecided Icetv vs Nine Jusgement... Court case goes against IceTV, because we now have a free service - and its found it only fair that these restrictions of use are kept to protect other interests (likely - but blah!) or hopefully icetv wins, and this is another nail showing that the requirement is really there!!!

So lets hope the government does not buy into the belief that the restrictions of use are neccessary, and still threatens to legislate for free open free to air epg !

Good write up impact - but the only thing that stands out is.. Why would all the other stations back a EPG service that would only help drive sales for a channel 7 venture?

Probably the fact that if they didn't they would be made to and this arrangement (that doesn't allow ad-skipping) is really the best they can hope for.

But the Feds wouldn't do anything that would harm the broadcasters anyway, Helen Coonan is their best friend.

Still...... no guide is even required for channel #bt, the best station

Cheers,

Arkay.

Because the other TV Networks also have aspirations for similar offerings (which will be devices driven most likely by Video On Demand / PPV services ).

As Impact has said - what is being "offered up" is something which everyone knows is a completely unworkable solution for MediaCenter and other such systems. (and thats EXACTLY what was intended).

So - yes some TV Station backed products will eventually come out - and some other companies desperate to get into the market will blow a lot of their budget on making their imported/rebranded products meet 'requirements' (and will result in less than superior systems with inferior capabilities and UX).

Most of the o/s vendors (Microsoft) will see no sense/advantage in pouring this sort of money into the puny Australian market (just a small spec on the global scale) - and hence we wont get this EPG where we actually want it.

So this 'EPG' will be just as accessible as things like Subtitles, Teletext and MHP = only available in very crappy hardware with very limited features and crap UX (ie Topfield).

So *we woz screwed* once again with this...

Niall

Kickbacks / Ratings / Advertiser dollars..... Ch7 via Engin will collect and collate the information about who is watching the shows and provide that to each of the other networks.... Probably try to eventually move out Nielson ratings while they are at it too!!!

Its better we do it, and help you, otherwise these hackers out there with their MCE machines will just be doing it anyway, and you will never categorically be able to prove anything for advertising revenue... So lets stop these systems and implement our own, and in doing so, we provide you with the ammunition to keep your millions of dollars in advertising revenue.

Some fair points, I'll chew it over.