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Re: Youth Day - Sad day for freedom of speech in Australia
Not at all. It has been covered in other newspapers, and on the news, the facts and penalties spelled out, and our elustrious state premier not discounting them at all.
And the NSW Bar Association certainly takes it seriously. We should too, unless one is more concerned about free EPG data than free speech (in which case one should get a serious reality check on what's important).
Re: Youth Day - Sad day for freedom of speech in Australia
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozbear
Not at all. It has been covered in other newspapers, and on the news, the facts and penalties spelled out, and our elustrious state premier not discounting them at all.
And the NSW Bar Association certainly takes it seriously. We should too, unless one is more concerned about free EPG data than free speech (in which case one should get a serious reality check on what's important).
Oz
We don't have actually have the right of free speech in the Australian legislature or constitution. maybe you should do some fact checking before going on fishing expeditions or trolling for attention.
But I agree free speech is fundamentally more important than the EPG.
__________________
That which is common to the greatest number has the least care bestowed upon it.
Aristotle
Re: Youth Day - Sad day for freedom of speech in Australia
Not all freedoms we enjoy are enshrined in the constitution, nor do they have to be. Some fundamental ones should be, however, so they cannot be abridged by bad (state) law without recourse.
I have no idea (nor do I particularly care) how you find this a fishing expedition or trolling. Governments become represessive by stealing rights and freedoms bit by bit. I thought this was an important issue which is why I brought it up.
Re: Youth Day - Sad day for freedom of speech in Australia
I don't see this as a great swipe at free speech per se. These laws only apply in certain areas and are in place to prevent civil unrest.
Yuo can still express any view you like about World Youth Day, just not in a manner and area likely to have inflammatory results.
Free speech is a fundamental right and freedom we should all cherish, but with such freedom comes a responsiblity to exercise it wisely. Sure, we can have any opinion we want, but as a (supposedly) intelligent person, I voice those opinions in a manner, time and place that will not cause undue reaction from those whose opinions differ.
Sadly not everyone is intelligent enough to be descerning enough to know when to shut up and various groups will make inflammitory statements and other offensive acts which will result in potential riots. Laws like these are put in place to prevent that.
I wish they were not in palce too, but the reality is without them there can be big problems.
Re: Youth Day - Sad day for freedom of speech in Australia
Glen,
I agree that at times it can require walking a fine line between abridgement of a freedom and preserving a common good/peace. In this particular case, merely annoying, by wearing a t-shirt is enough to attract a fine. I think that is unreasonable.
There is similar nonsense going on in Germany, so I read, where it is now an illegal to offend aother person in certain ways, such as by flipping them the bird/giving them the finger.
People are always willing to trade rights for (perceived) security. Eternal vigilance against such encroachments is the price of freedom.
Re: Youth Day - Sad day for freedom of speech in Australia
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozbear
Glen,
I agree that at times it can require walking a fine line between abridgement of a freedom and preserving a common good/peace. In this particular case, merely annoying, by wearing a t-shirt is enough to attract a fine. I think that is unreasonable.
There is similar nonsense going on in Germany, so I read, where it is now an illegal to offend aother person in certain ways, such as by flipping them the bird/giving them the finger.
People are always willing to trade rights for (perceived) security. Eternal vigilance against such encroachments is the price of freedom.
Oz
Wearing t-shirts with slogans meant to purposefully incite or enrage another group is NOT free speech, getting "inyourface" with a condom is NOT free speech. Both are purpose "built" to incite a negative reaction from the other side. I'd be more worried about the missuse of "freedom of speech" or are you under the impression that "freedom of speech" cannot be missused.
__________________
That which is common to the greatest number has the least care bestowed upon it.
Aristotle
Re: Youth Day - Sad day for freedom of speech in Australia
I think this is different to the German situation. These laws are only temporary - they have been written with a sunset date. Also, it is only an offence to annoy them in the designated areas - again certain T-shirts/slogans/posters/etc could cause a lot of civil unrest within the designated areas.
Yes, eternal vigilance is important. If these laws were either blanket in their area of enforcement and/or permanent I too would be very concerned.
Re: Youth Day - Sad day for freedom of speech in Australia
Quote:
Originally Posted by ExtremePC
Wearing t-shirts with slogans meant to purposefully incite or enrage another group is NOT free speech, getting "inyourface" with a condom is NOT free speech. Both are purpose "built" to incite a negative reaction from the other side. I'd be more worried about the missuse of "freedom of speech" or are you under the impression that "freedom of speech" cannot be missused.
The world must be taking a strange turn - I agree with you Extreme.
There is what I think a well thought-out blog on free speech and the responsibilies that should accompany it here.
Quote:
We need to harmonise our freedom of speech with the ethical responsibility for the consequences of what we say.
Some questions to ponder:
When does your right to free speech trump the dignity of others?
When is it more important to preserve respectful and co-operative relations, even at the cost of holding one’s tongue?
When is it better to adopt some intellectual humility, concede one is out of one’s depth, and just shut up?
What does it mean for speech to be free, if the cost of that speech is high – in reputation, in psychic distress, in physical damage, or even in lives?
Have we defended free speech if our remarks damage the social fabric that makes free speech possible?
As Spider-Man creator Stan Lee put it: “With great power comes great responsibility”. Perhaps the value of free speech would be better preserved if we took more notice of the latter than the former.
